Bedroom tax is making me even more ill

12:06pm Tuesday 9th October 2012 in Letters

IN response to the letter “Bullying Government” (Mailbox, September 19), I wrote to the Globe a couple of months ago warning of this “bedroom tax.”

The Government has tried to keep this as low-key as possible - it is a tax on people on benefit and in social housing only.

I am 57 years old, have been in my home for 32 years and have family to stay regularly.

This is important to me as I have mental health problems and some physical disabilities and so am unable to work.

Wirral Partnership Homes will be charging us £100 per month for my so-called spare rooms and have informed me if I get into arrears I will be evicted. As your reader wrote, there are no alternative accommodation.

The £100 per month is my care fund, so basically they are taking my care money from me. All this has made me so ill I have had to go back to my doctor.

My medication has had to be increased and they’ve referred me to a counsellor.

This all costs money, so it’s defeating the object!

Oh, but WPH are willing to sell me my home at a £75,000 reduction if I had the money. And I thought it was about freeing up social housing?

S Davis, Bebington.

Comments(33)

Mike304 says...
8:29am Wed 10 Oct 12

This so-called "bedroom tax" is the single most pressing reason I've switched from being a life-long Tory voter. It has convinced me that the current government is out-of-touch with the common man and, while I accept it has a difficult job to do in restoring the country's financial viability, it is threatening the fabric of our society and the wellbeing of its less fortunate and vulnerable citizens.

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Uncle_Fester says...
8:31am Wed 10 Oct 12

Everyone has to pay their way. People on benefits for whatever reason are provided with cash by tax payers, in the form of the various benefits to enable them to pay their way. So why do so many people who receive these benefits, (either rightly or wrongly in some cases) always complain when asked to use some of it to pay their way like the rest of us? We both work, in good jobs too, but we cannot afford to have another child, partly because we cant afford suitable accommodation.

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shelly200 says...
8:58am Wed 10 Oct 12

Could you please tell me how a "Bedroom Tax" being introduced in April 2013 will help free up the social housing stock?

People over 61 have been exempted from this tax and yet they occupy well over 50% of the larger homes that this cynical attack on the less well off is supposed to be designed for.

Add to this the fact that councils up and down the land simply do not have the smaller stock needed to allow people to downsize, and it becomes clear that this is simply yet another attack on the poorest, and most vulnerable in society, people on benefits who are already swimming against a tide of rising fuel and food prices and cuts in areas they depend on.

It will cause untold hardship on people unable to find suitable social housing that does not exist, or are unable to physically make or afford the removal cost of such an upheaval.

People on low wages struggling to make ends meet will have to make stark choices. If they have to move out of the area they live in, they could find that there are no jobs in the area they move to.

No matter how it is dressed up, this is a tax on the already hard done by, the poor and the vulnerable in society. It is a tax that will have adverse effect on many people, splitting communities and families apart.

This Conservative party is fast becoming the party that is attacking the poor because they are in the pockets of the rich they are attacking the disabled the poor an the vunerable

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Hon says...
9:41am Wed 10 Oct 12

Ah the old bedrooms tax issue. I’m a firm believer that if you require certain elements then you should work or pay towards them no matter whom you are. I do agree the most vulnerable in our society need the extra help but its all swings and roundabouts. I know there is probably a lot of people who claim that their circumstances are different i.e. single mothers yet the father lives with them and they just pretend they don’t and other aspects i.e. low income etc. I think the government are squeezing a system that is costing the country billions, as we have become a welfare state. For some the drive to go out and work just isn’t there as they can claim benefits and sit at home messing about hence these vast estates of social housing. I work, I pay taxes and I have the drive to do well in life, as I prefer to do that then live on those sorts of benefits. Myself personally have only needed to call on Job Seekers for one month of my life as when I was made redundant I just go out there fast!. My friends wife whom claims tax credits as my friend earns a low income said she could if they wanted have my friend live at his mums and ‘do the dirty’ and that way he would be around more their baby but I know my friend wouldn’t do that he has some drive and loves providing care in the mental health sector. Its all swings and roundabouts everyone has to pay their way and should do. Rich/Poor/Middle Class. On the subject of Rich remember a good portion have had the drive and started from the roots i.e. poor e.g. Alan Sugar and anyone CAN do it if they want to. It’s as much as the person as it is the system. So when we talk about paying their way its still 45% of their income is taxed that’s a lot of money.

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Spiffy says...
10:54am Wed 10 Oct 12

What is a "£100 per month care fund" ? Is it seperate to other benefits and who is entitled to it ? I've never heard of such a thing ?

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Haddy Nuff says...
12:59pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Spiffy, you're on the ball again,lol

Probably using the term loosely to mean his other care benefits (DLA etc).

What about a rebate if your children HAVE to share bedrooms? That way the poorest would not be hit so hard, and the wealthier than those who are already poverty stricken have the option to downsize.

A relative who is in the housing system, has live in partner, one child already and another on the way, they simply haven't the space for their children to share bedrooms of the tiny 2bed property. Yet the system won't rehouse?

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Uncle_Fester says...
2:17pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Haddy Nuff wrote:
Spiffy, you're on the ball again,lol

Probably using the term loosely to mean his other care benefits (DLA etc).

What about a rebate if your children HAVE to share bedrooms? That way the poorest would not be hit so hard, and the wealthier than those who are already poverty stricken have the option to downsize.

A relative who is in the housing system, has live in partner, one child already and another on the way, they simply haven't the space for their children to share bedrooms of the tiny 2bed property. Yet the system won't rehouse?
For those of us unlucky enough not to be in the "system," if we cant afford to house and keep kids, we don't make them.. Nobody will help us like that... Are people who are in the "system" superior citizens, compared to the mugs who aren't?

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Haddy Nuff says...
4:30pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Contrary to the impression you give on those not in the "housing system", we don't consider the number of bedrooms we have when we have coitus, the same as those in the "housing system". wether or not you want to expand your family can be, but not always, be a conscious decision. Some couples who are in long term relationships won't even consider birth control, whether for convenience, religious or other reasons.

If there wasn't so many asylum seekers and il/legal immigrants there wouldn't be a housing problem. The wife of that Abu Hamza currently lives with 2 children in a 5bed propertywithin the "housing system". They 'would like' to rehouse her (downsize), but can only request, not demand!

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Positive thinker says...
5:31pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Uncle Fester is bang on target with his
views,its always the takers who make the most noise when there's a threat of
A benifet being withdrawn which shouldn't of been given in the first place.You get the hardworking people who get up every morning go to work
pay there way in life don't moan proabley have very little if anything left
after paying rent or mortgage,it called pride and I would say its a thing to very proud of.The sooner these scum bags are sorted the better

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Haddy Nuff says...
5:53pm Wed 10 Oct 12

A family can expand whilst in good paid employment and then end up in the job-seeker queue sometime later.... So family planning doesn't help you there...

Perhaps a window tax could be considered.... Those who sit in huge conservatories whilst enjoying the gardener-tended scenery of their grounds can afford to pay or downsize.

But it was probably folk just like those I speak of who pushed and voted in favour of a bedroom tax over a window tax!

UK will end up like Thailand with both extremes (poverty/super-rich) living alongside each other with very little middle-class.

Following the formation and promises/cuts of the coalition and the dodger dealings behind the closed doors of Wirral Borough Council, I don't trust any of the departments or the folk who work there anymore. I have always conformed, but now I'm ready for the revolution.

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Positive thinker says...
6:07pm Wed 10 Oct 12

I don't think anyone is talking about genuine case's there talking about the generations of diehard scum who's only intention in life is to take and sponge of the state as to the headline
It's making me even more ill,most of the decent people with the self pride to get up and go to work must feel ill with the very thought of they would be better of not going to work ie a brand new house paid for by the state along with the new car paid for by the disability system need I go on

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EddieGremlin says...
6:55pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Oh dear, once again the we have the oh so pompous lot spouting "I am a TAX Payer" How jealous can you get? DLA take it away, maybe you'd like the disability too huh! Thought not! Though not everyone is disabled some believe it or not actually WORK for a living, but are so poorly paid they need the tax credits and housing benefit they receive just to keep their heads above water.... But you begrudge that don't you. The tiny mind of SCROOGE that is so common now since the TORYS got back in.

Of course we have some families who play the system live in big houses get to travel the world on jolly's and all at your expense. But hey what am I saying you LIKE the royal family don't you, so you don't mind THEM using your TAX money.

For those of you who maybe affected by the bedroom "tax" there is a web-page on facebook - www.facebook.com/gro
ups/antibedroomtax/

We also have a couple of shows per week on www.awakeradio.co.uk


We the tenants are organizing, we will not stand for a Fascist Nazi State.

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Positive thinker says...
7:24pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Touchy not hit a nerve have I ? One thing I don't begrudge anyone who gets up and goes out to work is any top up they are entitled to,what I do begrudge hopefully along with many other people on this blog is the parasites out there who have no intention of ever getting up and putting some effort into a days work,most of them put as much effort into fleecing the system

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EddieGremlin says...
8:18pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Positive thinker wrote:
Touchy not hit a nerve have I ? One thing I don't begrudge anyone who gets up and goes out to work is any top up they are entitled to,what I do begrudge hopefully along with many other people on this blog is the parasites out there who have no intention of ever getting up and putting some effort into a days work,most of them put as much effort into fleecing the system
No, but I seem to have got one of yours. Do your research!

And as far as I have observed other than Andrew (and his contribution in the Falklands was overstated as propaganda) NOT ONE of the ROYAL PARASITES have ever broke a sweat doing ANY kind of labour...

Facts: All figures are in the public domain and many of them are sourced under the Freedom Of Information (FOI) Act.

1) The Government “Deficit” was £83 Billion in 2010. Despite 2 years of cuts ... the “Deficit” has increased.

2) The major companies and corporations in the UK are sitting on reserves/profits in excess of £750 Billion.

3) They refuse to invest because they cannot make “a big enough profit”.

4) There is $21/£13 Trillion stashed away in Tax Havens, paying little or no tax.

5) £13 Trillion is equal to 10 times the total wealth produced in the UK annually.

6) Up to £120 billion is avoided/evaded in taxes by the corporations and the super-rich here in the UK each year ... where is the Deficit?

7) Less than 20% of the “Austerity programme” has been implemented ... 80% more to come. NHS sell-off etc, etc.

8) It is now confirmed that 73 people die each week after they had been passed “Fit for work” and lost their ESA (Sickness) benefit.
From January to November of 2011 ... 10,600 people who had been removed or transferred from Benefits died during that period of 11 months.

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Positive thinker says...
8:27pm Wed 10 Oct 12

It would appear there's more in favour of bedroom tax than against it,correct me if I am wrong having looked it up the basics are is why should the goverment pay housing benifet for a room they consider not to be a requirement of the person claiming

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Haddy Nuff says...
9:05pm Wed 10 Oct 12

So make it ratio calculated...

No of rooms divided by no of tenants.

A 5 bed house with 2 occupants = 2.5 a high score,

a 3 bed house with 4 occupants = 0.75, a low score.

Maybe if you score anything above 1 you pay band a, above 2 band b etc

Perhaps that would be fairer?

It might encourage (and may have even been part of the reasoning behind such a tax) young adults to stay at home a bit longer which is what the government wanted.

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EddieGremlin says...
10:43pm Wed 10 Oct 12

And there we have it, make a stand, do research, find where the real problems lay and if it doesn't fit in with your political leanings.

Can't wait for your protestations when the redirected benefits system loading's changes from Government to Local Councils and YOUR COUNCIL TAX SKY ROCKETS!

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don't look back in anger says...
1:17pm Thu 11 Oct 12

I get up at 6am every day for work and i have athritis in my knees, hands and hips and one has been replaced 3 years ago. I have spent thousands of pounds on my home which is rented from WPH and yet after working all my life and spending all my hard earned money on my property I could one day be forced out, because I lose my job or my son moves out to University, as he intends too. I'm 45 yrs old and in my current condition I will never get to retirement age in work, because I have too many health problems and yet if I am forced to leave work and I have a bedroom which is empty because my son has gone to University, then I'll simply be forced out of my home thru no fault of my own, because I'll not be able to afford this ruthless bedroom tax. Now you tell me that's a fair deal, cos I don't see it.

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Weary Wabbit says...
3:26pm Thu 11 Oct 12

I am my mother's carer, I gave up my WPH flat to move in and care for her where she has lived for over 50 years and where I grew up. When she is no longer with us I will be forced out or have to pay more to stay where I am.
I currently have absolutely no incentive to maintain this house. I bought decorating materials and then heard about this bedroom tax. I could decorate this house only to find myself having to spend all over again on wherever they move me to.
Considering I'm saving the state money by caring for my mum at home I feel totally let down by this bedroom tax and scary future prospects. I don't have a lot of money so I'm certainly not going to waste it on where I am unless they change their minds and tell me this will remain my home.

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Haddy Nuff says...
6:43pm Thu 11 Oct 12

don't look back in anger wrote:
I get up at 6am every day for work and i have athritis in my knees, hands and hips and one has been replaced 3 years ago. I have spent thousands of pounds on my home which is rented from WPH and yet after working all my life and spending all my hard earned money on my property I could one day be forced out, because I lose my job or my son moves out to University, as he intends too. I'm 45 yrs old and in my current condition I will never get to retirement age in work, because I have too many health problems and yet if I am forced to leave work and I have a bedroom which is empty because my son has gone to University, then I'll simply be forced out of my home thru no fault of my own, because I'll not be able to afford this ruthless bedroom tax. Now you tell me that's a fair deal, cos I don't see it.
Surely as university is only temporary they will class your son as a resident (they need permanent residence too). Just the same as those in the armed forces, and working abroad. If its their main residence surely they can't class it as a "spare" room (?)

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don't look back in anger says...
8:13pm Thu 11 Oct 12

Haddy Nuff wrote:
don't look back in anger wrote:
I get up at 6am every day for work and i have athritis in my knees, hands and hips and one has been replaced 3 years ago. I have spent thousands of pounds on my home which is rented from WPH and yet after working all my life and spending all my hard earned money on my property I could one day be forced out, because I lose my job or my son moves out to University, as he intends too. I'm 45 yrs old and in my current condition I will never get to retirement age in work, because I have too many health problems and yet if I am forced to leave work and I have a bedroom which is empty because my son has gone to University, then I'll simply be forced out of my home thru no fault of my own, because I'll not be able to afford this ruthless bedroom tax. Now you tell me that's a fair deal, cos I don't see it.
Surely as university is only temporary they will class your son as a resident (they need permanent residence too). Just the same as those in the armed forces, and working abroad. If its their main residence surely they can't class it as a "spare" room (?)
Not exactly sure how it works but it worries me already. He could and may well move out before I reach 60 when the bedroom tax then doesn't apply and I could still be forced out of my home that I have greatly improved since i first rented it from WPH. This bedroom tax is ruthless and this Tory Government are not in the real world. WPH did a visit to my house and couldn't belive the changes i'd made too it after I took it from a person who was evicted for damaging the property and yet they could come along one day and say, thanks for all you've done, but you've got to leave. There is no fairness in this ridiculous idea.

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Realistically speaking says...
11:49am Fri 12 Oct 12

WPH wouldn't evict a resident without exploring every possible solution first. Their welfare benefit team will help residents maximise their income and they can refer people through to debt advice. They can help direct people to training and have a worklessness strategy. They will also be helping people apply for discretionary housing payments from the Council once its nearer the time. WPH have already moved around 20 people into smaller properties where residents wanted to and are contacting tenants to see if this is an option. Also mutual exchanges can take place, eg where people are overcrowded in a property, they can swap with someone who is under occupying. Check out their website for the bedroom tax calculator to see if you will be affected. www.wphomes.org.uk

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littlestar84 says...
4:30pm Sun 14 Oct 12

I note someone saying they don't begrudge anyone who goes out to work and gets 'tops ups'... they are still benefits. If the minium wage was decent enough for people to actually live on, and if childcare was affordable, there wouldn't be any need for 'top ups'.

I completely oppose this 'bedroom tax', once again it's the government setting off people against one another, the 'scroungers' who should 'pay their way'. Why not target the banks, big businesses and MPs who fiddle their expenses, why target people who have in many cases lived in their housing a long time. Why should the rules suddenly change? I imagine it will cost the country a lot more in GP costs, prescriptions charges, counsellors and appeals.

And why are there the usual cries of 'free cars for the disabled' and 'brand new housing for those who wont work'? Do you actually read up on social policy or do you just read the Daily Mail? I know a teacher who is currently out of work with mental health problems (a breakdown due to work-related pressures due to other government saving drives) he cannot make ends meet with what he gets in so-called' benefits' and he has worked for 25 years. Go and actually meet people effected by these regimes.

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Haddy Nuff says...
10:48am Mon 15 Oct 12

If they collar the major corporation tax dodgers there would be no need for any of these cuts to benefits, NHS, police/fire services... If JUST ONE major commercial organisation were to pay taxes they have avoided (which are currently paid in other EU countries since we are EUmembers) the deficit would be amended such that no cuts would be made... But since we are EU members they are within their rights to pay less tax elsewhere. Imagine the economy of UK if we were not part of the EU, and more taxes were paid via HMRC!

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carlasway says...
11:35am Mon 15 Oct 12

like you S Davis, I will also be affected by the bedroom tax, I am classed as being under-occupied by 2 bedrooms, i will be put in severe poverty as i will have to try to make up the difference myself it would leave me with no option but to cut back on essential food and also cut back on fuel usage, as I will find it impossible to fund both. So I will either starve to death or freeze to death, or even become homeless.
this tax can and will only bring greater poverty/hardship to the most vulnerable and already struggling, . The government has implemented this tax, because they know there is not enough smaller accommodation to rehouse everyone who is classed as being under-occupied, they are guaranteed this extra revenue, as long as they take it of the poor, sick & disabled, they do not care.
. we will be forced to live like battery reared hens, squeezed into the smallest accommodation that can be found for us all, or will cardboard cities be set up for us all, this is another STEALTH TAX designed to tax the poor. People on low wage in receipt of some housing benefit will also be affected.
This government have vilified & scapegoated the sick vulnerable and disabled, unemployed, they have whipped up divisions in society using blatent propaganda techniques, and demolished hard won-rights and protections..They have no morality, no sense of stewardship of our country and it’s laws or responsibility to citizens. They got into government and made it a help-yourself free-for all for rich buddies.
How hypicrital is this government, do the public not realise that all MPs claim housing benefit, AKA 2nd home allowances, you don’t see them getting vilified. ? Because they are a class of rich expensively educated out of touch toffs who hate ordinary people. All I can say is Don't be old, don't be ill, don't be unemployed under this government there is nothing down for you.

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Uncle_Fester says...
11:50am Mon 15 Oct 12

When someone cannot afford to pay the rent, the government gives them tax payers money in the form of housing benefit to ensure that they have a roof over their heads. Fair enough....but what they are now saying is that they will not use hard earned tax payers money to pay for spare rooms. Everyone has the option to either contribute towards their spare room, or down size a house that is of suitable size for their family and let the tax payer continue to fund it for them.That is very fair indeed.

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Positive thinker says...
2:30pm Mon 15 Oct 12

Uncle Fester,

It looks like we're on are own on
this one,it would appear no one else
gets it

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Dazzzler says...
6:44pm Mon 15 Oct 12

Against it and please read I will be quick and blunt.

1) This only applies to those renting from Housing associations, so 2 families with exactly the same circumstances living next door to each other. One is WPH charging £80 a week, the other is renting from a private landlord for £105 a week, only the WPH tenant is affected so more private landlords will pop up in these areas which will eventually cost more than they save with the TAX.

2) Those who are in the situation for real and not playing the system respect the home (so when they do leave the property it is normally in a reasonible condition) are normally the same ones who will have sensible family values, bring up children correctly and so on. The ones who play the system will think nothing of breeding more to keep the home which in turn again will cost more in the long run.

This TAX was probably thought of in good faith but it seems nobody has really looked at a sensible way of making sure it works correctly.

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Haddy Nuff says...
7:10pm Mon 15 Oct 12

what rate do they impose?

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Haddy Nuff says...
7:30pm Tue 16 Oct 12

See BBC news article http://www.bbc.co.uk
/news/business-19967
397 about major companies avoiding tax!

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EddieGremlin says...
9:34pm Wed 17 Oct 12

Let me tell you a story about 2 positive thinkers and 1 negative thinker: The first positive thinker wanted to build a house good enough to keep the wolf at bay. So he set about building his one bedroom house with straw.
The second positive thinker wanted to build a house good enough to keep the wolf at bay. So he set about building his one bedroom house with sticks.
The negative thinker wanted to build a house good enough to keep the wolf at bay, and he thought the other two in cloud cuckoo land thinking building with straw and sticks would keep the wolf at bay.

I think you might know how this little story ends.

If you are on the wirral and have a facebook account goto:
facebook.com/groups/
antibedroomtax

You can see what a bit of good negative thinking can do for you too..

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angeleye74 says...
6:19pm Tue 30 Oct 12

Uncle_Fester wrote:
Everyone has to pay their way. People on benefits for whatever reason are provided with cash by tax payers, in the form of the various benefits to enable them to pay their way. So why do so many people who receive these benefits, (either rightly or wrongly in some cases) always complain when asked to use some of it to pay their way like the rest of us? We both work, in good jobs too, but we cannot afford to have another child, partly because we cant afford suitable accommodation.
Have you even any idea how little benifits are? I myself am working with a programme that will help me get a job finnaly and have better finances. For the time being I'm on benifits, I get £142 every 2 weeks, my rent is only £113 a month thanks to housing benifits, I have oil heating in my house and that's very expensive, not to mention electricity. You do the math, I'm glad I'm able to buy myself food to eat, there is no more room for people on benifits to pay any more. I agree that people whoe refuse to work should get of their backside and try to find work, but you can't expect people to live of even less than they allready have to, that's not realistic at all. Put yourself in the shoes of having to live of that anount of money, have a little humanity.

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Bedroom Tax says...
6:21pm Wed 31 Oct 12

We are a group on Facebook looking to oppose this Tax every step of the way , we are growing in numbers and support , we have a member with a twice weekly radio slot dedicated to this Tax and other Benefit cuts , feel free to join us here ..
...https://www.faceb
ook.com/groups/53177
5566839406/

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